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Stabilising debt is only the first step to sustainable spending policies and more changes are needed as New Zealand population ages, says Treasury’s Dominick Stephens

Public Policy / news
Stabilising debt is only the first step to sustainable spending policies and more changes are needed as New Zealand population ages, says Treasury’s Dominick Stephens
Finance Minister Nicola Willis appears before Parliament’s Finance and Expenditure Committee in April 2024
Finance Minister Nicola Willis appears before Parliament’s Finance and Expenditure Committee in April 2024 (Photo by Daniel Brunskill)

New Zealand’s fiscal settings are not sustainable in the long-term and the spending cuts required to balance the budget this decade are “unprecedented” in recent history. 

That’s the view of the Treasury’s chief economic advisor, Dominick Stephens, who gave a speech on debt, deficits and the ageing population in Queenstown on Thursday.  

His speech reiterated the Government agency’s often repeated message that New Zealand’s fiscal settings will not be able to cope with the ageing population.

The Treasury had been “banging the drum” on the need for policy reform for many years but higher levels of government debt had now added to the fiscal challenge, he said. 

It was in 2006 that analysts first advised net debt would rise exponentially as the population aged, unless significant policy changes were made to prevent that outcome. 

At the time, net core Crown debt was forecast to be roughly 13% of gross domestic product in the year ended June 2020. In actuality, it ended up at 26% and has risen to 39.3%. 

“Starting out with higher debt increases the sustainability challenge, because of the compounding nature of interest,” Stephens said. 

At minimum, the Government’s annual operating costs need to be brought back into balance with its revenues just to halt the growth of debt. But Finance Minister Nicola Willis wants to go even further and reduce overall debt levels in the long term — this would be a challenge. 

Treasury has estimated New Zealand would be in deficit even if the country was in normal economic times rather than recession, and the Coalition have compounded the problem with tax cuts

Willis has opted for new spending allowances of just $2.4 billion each budget through to 2027 in order to return the Crown accounts to a surplus in the year ended June 2028. That allowance is $100 million less than the estimated costs of delivering existing services. 

“This means that the Government will have to increase revenue or reduce the amount that it spends per person, in inflation adjusted terms, to meet this target,” Stephens said in his speech. 

“The Treasury’s latest forecasts assume that most of the return to surplus will be driven by declines in per capita government consumption. The implied speed and size of this decline is generally unprecedented in recent history in New Zealand.” 

Michael Reddell, an independent economic commentator, said on Twitter that this comment shouldn’t be overblown as spending levels were coming down from abnormally high levels.

“While the implied decline is sharp, so has been the decline in the last couple of years, and the increase since 2019 was also without precedent in recent times,” he wrote.

Reddell also pointed out this analysis assumed only spending cuts were used to achieve a surplus, and didn’t factor in planned revenue increases. 

Simon Watts, the Minister for Revenue, said the Coalition was focused on the spending side of the equation. However, they were taking advice on collecting more from unpaid student loans overseas and possibly taxing charities which operate as commercial businesses.

Looking ahead

Despite the headline-grabbing comment, Stephen’s speech was about the fiscal challenge of an aging population over the next five decades. The cuts per capita planned over the next four years will only stop this from getting worse, it won’t do anything to solve it.

The problem is really the opposite of a problem: New Zealanders are living longer and better lives. While this is unquestionably good, it hasn’t been budgeted for in existing policies.

Stephens said there were seven working age people for every person aged over 65 back in the 1960s, but today there were only four and in 50 years’ time there may be just two.

NZ spends considerably more on people over-65 than it gathers from them in taxes, and therefore will find the public purse “stretched further and further” as the population ages. 

There have been three unexpected developments which are helping to offset the impact, even as higher-than-expected debt makes the challenge harder to meet.

Seniors are staying in work much longer, the population has grown faster, and long-term interest rates are lower than forecasters had predicted when first sounding the alarm. 

Stephens said it was “hard to overstate how profound” the first change had been. NZ has gone from having one of the lowest rates of over-65s working in the OECD, to one of the highest. 

Labour market participation of 65 to 69 year olds was first forecast to be around 38% in 2023 but it was actually 49%. Even 27% of those in their early 70s were still working that year.

This may be partly because earning extra income doesn’t reduce superannuation payments and therefore discourage people from staying in work. 

“The downside of universality is that it makes National Superannuation expensive, as discussed earlier. This tension between affordability and work incentives will need to be balanced in future thinking about the design of retirement policies,” Stephens said. 

Faster population growth has also helped reduce NZ’s average age and made universal healthcare and superannuation more affordable. The population is 10.5% larger today than it was forecast to be in 2006. 

Act early

Regardless, these helpful developments are not enough to stop a rapid increase in debt over the next few decades. Governments will have to adjust their policy settings. 

“There is no silver bullet: none of the policy options we modelled in 2021 was large enough to stabilise debt on its own. This means that governments will likely need to draw on multiple expenditure and revenue changes to close the fiscal gap,” Stephens said. 

Managing the amount of money spent on healthcare would be critical, as it is a fast growing part of total spending and isn’t likely to get significantly cheaper in the future. 

The Government could also choose to raise taxes, although this comes with economic costs and would require successive increases if the costs were not also reduced. 

Stephens said boosting productivity would be vital for improving New Zealand’s general economic wellbeing but would have minimal impact on this particular problem. 

“Higher productivity growth would boost wages, which flows through to higher wage-indexed superannuation payments and higher costs of providing labour-intensive public services.”

Finally, the Treasury has advised the Government to select some solutions soon, so that young New Zealanders can feel confident they will not be short-changed in the future.

There is already a growing wealth gap between younger and older New Zealanders, which could translate into a reluctance to support their retirements.    

“Acting early to ensure fiscal sustainability will help sustain this trust and may bolster the willingness of future generations to continue participating in our pay-as-you-go pension provision system,” Stephens said.

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34 Comments

It concerns me that Zorro is in such a senior position at Treasury. His work at Westpac always struck me as mediocre.

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This is a lot less complicated than Treasury are making it. If, as a country, we need more of our people, materials, energy, machines etc dedicated to meeting the needs of older people, then, all else being equal, we just need to shift some of the real resources currently being used for other things over to that new purpose.

Govt has a simple tool that is literally designed to reduce private sector consumption and ensure that there are enough real resources available to do what they need to be done - that tool is called 'tax'. So, tax people who spend a lot so that they consume less real resources, and then spend a bit more money on stuff that older people need. The net impact of this shift is less people selling us crap we don't need in Briscoes, and more care workers. Fewer helipads on Waiheke, more residential homes. Less SUV tanks on the roads, and more ambulances.

The trap that Treasury are falling into (and many do) is thinking about this challenge in financial terms - like we have to find the money! It is not a money problem, it is a resource problem. I would recommend Treasury revisit the Keynes' classic 'How to pay for the War'.

 

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Run the numbers for me how having less SUVs on the road gets into the same train of thought as helicopter landing pads.

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Just examples of things that we buy that we don't need. Around a third of the new cars we buy have engine sizes above 2000cc - over-powered for general use on our roads. SUVs are also heavy, dangerous and resource-intensive - and, in the future, they will be a huge waste of batteries that we could be using for other things. If we were thinking as a country in resource terms, we would tax the hell out of luxury items like this, so that fewer people bought them, and we had the resources needed to support our changing population (and do other sensible stuff like re-build our railways).    

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This is unhinged but OK? Not sure why someone having a car big enough to serve all their needs represents some sort of existential capital crisis that must be taxed off the roads immediately, but sure.

Kinda feel like we should be doing thing like supporting our population's needs and bringing in public transit without the need to meltdown over what are usually just lifted wagons. 

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It was just an example! We consume a lot of stuff we don't need. My point is simply that we have enough real resources to meet the needs of our population, even as that population ages considerably. We just need to distribute the resources differently and be more strategic (e.g. investing in productivity and effiency).

Which SUV have you got?  

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I don't.

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Unfortunately increasing taxation reduces private pending by increasing government spending.  

Giving the government more money is very seldom "investing in productivity and efficiency". 

 

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This is the kind of argument that Americans use to have an F150 in every driveway. It's necessary to drop the kids off to soccer in a "truck", because you might swing by Walmart and pick up a double-door fridge on the way home. Ergo if you have one car you must have the biggest car to serve any need you may occasionally have.

In NZ this doesn't happen because indirectly we tax this by making petrol so expensive that even wealthier families would wince at the cost to run such a vehicle. Instead they get Harvey Norman to deliver the fridge once a decade instead.

The exception of course is vehicles where FBT for personal use and tax deductible fuel applies - this is why tradies have utes. The last sparky that came to our place had all his tools in the boot of a Corolla and it struck me as absolutely absurd. But the tools all fit, and he said it's easier to find a park at downtown job sites than a ute... He obviously doesn't have a good enough accountant.

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OK, and? An SUV is just a form factor, there's plenty of SUVs which are relatively compact. I'm not sure you can conflate a Mini Countryman with a Ford F150 in any sane world. Most SUVs we sell in NZ would be considered tiny in the American market. 

But it sounds like you guys need to make up your mind. Have a car big enough to handle all your family outings (prams, bikes, travel cots etc)? No that's bad. Taking multiple smaller cars on the same journey because at least it's not a big car = somehow makes more sense?

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Yes, sure, but smaller SUVs only exist because people can't afford to run a "real" one. The form factor doesn't make a lot of sense otherwise. If petrol cost half as much and a 4L SUV wasn't much more expensive you can imagine many would go for that instead. So taxes and policies do have an impact on exactly what people decide they "need".

As it happens I have a 3.6L SUV because I need to tow the boat sometimes (not very often). But I have one car, and so it has to be able to do that. In an ideal world I would have a smaller car to take the kids around when I don't need the bigger one. I recognise the additional resources I'm consuming needlessly, rather than just make excuses for it, and I wouldn't begrudge policies that discourage me from using the bigger car when I don't need to.

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Good point - boats are another good example of excessive resource use.

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But most SUVs aren't needed to serve all their needs.  When was the last time you saw an SUV with mud on their tyres?  I'm sure there are some legitimate uses for a Hummer H1 (aside from going to war).  It doesn't mean it's a good idea for the whole country to use one to pick up some groceries.

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I would love to have a 2000cc vehicle but I can’t because I need a big SUV to tow my 7m boat.

 

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Helicopters are a business expense. 
how about means testing super and lifting age to 67.

capital gains tax may help you will not be paying unless you are making money 

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How will means-testing super and lifting age to 67 release the *real* resources that older people will need to live well - housing, care workers, GPs etc? Capital gains tax, sure, that could release some resources that could then be allocated to important stuff like housing and feeding old folk.

My point here is that the challenge is not financial - it is about having enough real resources to support the population. 

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The other issue is if we change things too much - whether our smart oung people will hang around, and young talent from overseas will come here to work. And of course whether the wealthy will stay.

If we increase taxes whilst we cut super , coupled with super-expensive housing and quite unexciting careers vs over seas....   i am not sure of the attraction.

compulsalary kiwisaver, CGT -> equate our taxes and pension plans with the rest of oecd first.. so its a level field.

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More tax does not realise resources it just raises money 

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So, let's say I spend $5 million a year doing up my house, paying the servants, eating out, throwing parties for my buddies. Then I get taxed and I only spend $4 million a year. How has that not released any real resources?!?

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Only if you have a compliant population that doesn't mind paying the increased tax.

If that were the case, NZers would pick shares over property and PIE funds wouldn't exist.

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We really should have an additional tax on people earning over a certain amount and still receiving Super. 

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Earning or receiving? If an over 65 is a capable maths teacher and continues to teach past 65, I've got no problem with them plugging our skills shortage while receiving their Super entitlement.

If someone is receiving $1m a year in term deposit interest maybe a different matter. However, they're taxed on that interest, and you could imagine the tax isn't that far off their Super payment, so they're still self-sustaining.

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Maybe we just need to stop the Superannuation welfare payments. Let those people pull themselves up by their bootstraps.

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I'm told Boomers are hard-working and hate a hand-out, so this shouldn't cause any problems. 

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They should simply buy fewer takeaway coffees. And iPhones. 

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Why is kiwi saver optional 

walks away shaking head at our own stupidity 

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The investment banker lobby groups are thought of as just greedy and self-interested.

Taking 5% of everyone's earnings and giving it to to accredited fund managers to "look after" is a great idea for investment banks.  They will definitely keep trying to make it compulsory and maybe one day will see a shift in public opinion.  

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I’m firmly in the dark green bar under x-axis. I will be old when we have only 2 tax payers per dependent. I could feel royally screwed by being in this demographic.

However, I say to the NACT whiners - draw a circle around the yellow bars on the 15-29yr age group, call these the “dole bludgers”, and then compare it to the size of the yellow bars in the 65+ age group…tell me who gets more welfare.

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Thay are coloured yellow as these are the ACT supporters

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$200,000,000,000 of resident term deposits in New Zealand. That's spare cash that people don't need for their day to day expenses. Much of it held by the 900,000 people aged over 65. 

Is the preservation of capital and the ability to leave an inheritance something that needs to be protected in   law ?  As it seems that is what is preventing a large portion of the population from accumulating any assets at all.  

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Stephens said there were seven working age people for every person aged over 65 back in the 1960s, but today there were only four and in 50 years’ time there may be just two.

If we were or are going to be working the fields, that would matter.

As PDK likes to point out, the real work is done by oil, not people. Thus a somewhat meaningless comparison.

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Wouldn't worry about 50 years time, there is a chance there will be no people or a situation where there is no way in hell you live past 60 anyway. I would put a total Mad Max scenario at better odds than 50/50.

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Get out now, while you can still take your assets with you.  Move to where superannuation and aged care costs are not going to cripple the country. 

In 2019 .... 'Australia has reached a major milestone, with most new retirees having enough savings to be self-funded rather than reliant on the age pension, new research shows.

More than half of 66-year-olds were not accessing the age pension at December 2018 because their assets and income were too high, while 20 per cent were on a part pension.

Only 25 per cent were drawing a full age pension."

https://www.afr.com/policy/tax-and-super/the-average-retiree-is-now-sel…

 

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Fundamentally we have an economy with more consumers per worker as our population ages:

https://data.worldbank.org/share/widget?indicators=SP.POP.1564.TO.ZS&lo…

 

We are entering a secular labour shortage and will be forced toward higher per capita productivity. When we have the next boom comes there will be an absolute knife fight for workers.

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